Latest post Wed, Apr 10 2013 2:19 PM by Job ter Burg. 33 replies.
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  • Wed, Mar 20 2013 6:31 PM

    AVID MC Export to Color Grading software SCRATCH

    The color grader wishes an MXF file of the sequence + an EDL.

    I never heard about export a mxf file.

    How is the export workflow for color grading softwares, especially SCRAtCH (assimiliate).

    Thanks a lot! n

  • Wed, Mar 20 2013 6:39 PM In reply to

    Re: AVID MC Export to Color Grading software SCRATCH

    Don't export the MXF (that would give you XDCAM-HD Op1a at best). Do a video mixdown of your sequence, do a File->Reveal File on that mixdown, send them that (large) Avid MXF mediafile. Scratch will eat that just fine, and you will not have any unnecessary codec conversions.

    Media Composer /w Symphony option | PT-HD | Win7Pro64 HP | OSX MBP | ISIS5000 | Nitris DX | Artist Mix & Transport & Color | AJA T-Tap | Decklink... [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Mar 20 2013 10:10 PM In reply to

    • Dan
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    Re: AVID MC Export to Color Grading software SCRATCH

    This is what I'd do for Resolve, but something similar might work for Scratch...

    Duplicate my sequence.

    Put it in a new bin.  This should help keep things organized.

    Collapse the clips in your new sequence to one video track.  EDLs = 1 video track.

    Transcode the sequence to whatever you want - don't forget to add handles.  This step has mainly to do with our material being at different frame rates (clips wouldn't show up in Resolve).  It might be unnecessary for you.

    Export a consolidated AAF with handles from your transcoded sequence.  I send the new consolidated media to the same folder as the AAF.  It makes sending it out to a colorist easy - you can copy the whole folder (AAF &  MXF files) to a portable drive, compress it, etc.

    From here, I can bring the AAF into Resolve and everything loads fine.  Or, you can export an EDL from the sequence that was made when you exported the AAF.  That would give you the benefit of sending your colorist something with handles.  The EDL will be referencing the clips in the new consolidated folder.  They should be able to send you back an AAF with individual clips that have handles in case you need to slide anything around.  I was able to load the EDL into resolve after loading the media into the media pool and export clips with handles.

     

    This might not be the most effective or the best workflow, but it seems to work.

  • Thu, Mar 21 2013 12:30 AM In reply to

    • jef
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    Re: AVID MC Export to Color Grading software SCRATCH

    Dan:
    Transcode the sequence to whatever you want - don't forget to add handles.  This step has mainly to do with our material being at different frame rates (clips wouldn't show up in Resolve).

    FYI in Resolve v9.1.1 we have had good luck with mixed frames material using an AAF round trip workflow.  You need to read the Resolve documentation about this and follow their instructions.

    Good luck,

    Jef

    Avid DS 11.0.2 R.I.P | MC "Well, it depends ..." mostly 8.10.0 but playing w 2018.11| OS 10.11.x - various MacPro Towers - home system MacPro... [view my complete system specs]

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  • Thu, Mar 21 2013 4:58 AM In reply to

    Re: AVID MC Export to Color Grading software SCRATCH

    I would not send AAF to Scratch, particularly not when the grader asks for an MXF.  Don't think Scratch is too great with AAF. Just Video Mixdown (no need to transcode, all fx will be rendered and baked in), use the resulting Avod MediaFile, Scratch will definitely work with that. Add EDL as specified, ensures Scratch can find every cut and transition.

    Media Composer /w Symphony option | PT-HD | Win7Pro64 HP | OSX MBP | ISIS5000 | Nitris DX | Artist Mix & Transport & Color | AJA T-Tap | Decklink... [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, Mar 21 2013 8:08 AM In reply to

    Re: AVID MC Export to Color Grading software SCRATCH

    Thank you very much - this is good help!

    A) How do I work with the Avid FX?

    We have 6 Videolayers with fx like:

    > motion fx

    >masks

    >3D Warp

    > transitions

    etc.

    The grader wants a "clean" version - without transitions.

    So should I take off evrything?

    B) Do I have to build the EDL from the videomixdown or from the based sequence with all the edits?

    C) Do I have to put every clip on the videolayer 1?

    D) How does the EDL have to look like? Wich parameters are important!

    Thank you alot! N

  • Thu, Mar 21 2013 12:29 PM In reply to

    Preparing Sequence for Edl to Color Grading on Scratch (asimiliate)

    The color grader wishes an MXF file of the sequence + an EDL.

    Therefore I got the advise of avid moderator Job ter Burg

    Do a video mixdown of your sequence, do a File->Reveal File on that mixdown, send them that (large) Avid MXF mediafile. Scratch will eat that just fine, and you will not have any unnecessary codec conversions.Use the resulting Avod MediaFile, Scratch will definitely work with that. Add EDL as specified, ensures Scratch can find every cut and transition.

     

    Now I have following questions:

    A) How do I work with the Avid FX?

    We have 6 Videolayers with fx like:

    > motion fx

    >masks

    >3D Warp

    > transitions

    etc.

     

    The grader wants a "clean" version - without transitions. ???

    So should I take off everything?

    B) Do I have to build the EDL from the videomixdown or from the based sequence with all the edits?

    C) Do I have to put every clip on the videolayer 1?

    D) How does the EDL have to look like? Wich parameters are important!

    Thank you alot! N

  • Thu, Mar 21 2013 12:37 PM In reply to

    Re: Preparing Sequence for Edl to Color Grading on Scratch (asimiliate)

    Wow you are going to have an uphill job.

    If you are using an non compatabile grading solution then you are making a lot of work.

    The issue here is that the grading system can't understand the Avid effects. If you remove them then you need to find a way to send the underlying shots to grade and then back to go under the effects.

    But then the grader can't see the end result and the effect may have an impact on that.

    The EDL is just a tool to allow the grader to cut up the flatterned file so they can grade the shots on the cut points.

    I'd have to say this is a workflow that should have been part of the job from the start. Been considered, tested and then implemented.

     

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  • Thu, Mar 21 2013 1:42 PM In reply to

    Re: Preparing Sequence for Edl to Color Grading on Scratch (asimiliate)

    Haven't sent anything to Scratch, but when we send stuff to DaVinci Resolve, they take an AAF or EDL of our sequence, but then link back to original media (RED, Canon, etc.) for grading, not using our Avid media.  But even then there are some effects you need to remove and adjust scenes that have motion effects on them

    And with the ability to render out with handles, you don't have to extend clips if you have dissolves and other transitions.  Any chance they could use one of these methods instead of the requested one?

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  • Thu, Mar 21 2013 2:05 PM In reply to

    Re: Preparing Sequence for Edl to Color Grading on Scratch (asimiliate)

    berlintownunder@googlemail.com:

    The grader wants a "clean" version - without transitions. ???

    So should I take off everything?

    No. Ask him, but most likely 'clean' would mean 'without captions or titles over picture'. So you mixdown everything, but move your titles up to an inactive V-layer. Scratch colorist will send you back an Avid MXF Mediafile of the graded show. You bring that into a bin via the Media Tool, then add it to a sequence and copy your title layer on top of it and you're ready for delivery.

    B) Do I have to build the EDL from the videomixdown or from the based sequence with all the edits?

    Yes. Otherwise it will be a one-event EDL that is useless to them.

    C) Do I have to put every clip on the videolayer 1?

    You could simplify your seq, so that no invisible 'phantom' events are in different layers. But if you want to take a shortcut, just tell EDL Manager to use all V-tracks. Every event in your timeline will be in there.

    D) How does the EDL have to look like? Wich parameters are important!

    Not many matter, since Record TC's are all they will care about.

    I'd pick CMX3600.

    Master List: Start / TC1 / Tape or File Name / Sequence / 1 / Sequence Timecode

    Dupe List: None.

    Options: Optimize the EDL, rest doesn't matter.

    Comments: probably irrelevant, uncheck them for clarity.

     

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  • Thu, Mar 21 2013 2:08 PM In reply to

    Re: Preparing Sequence for Edl to Color Grading on Scratch (asimiliate)

    Kevin Klimek:
    Haven't sent anything to Scratch, but when we send stuff to DaVinci Resolve, they take an AAF or EDL of our sequence, but then link back to original media
    However, thats not what's being asked now.

    Most of my stuff gets done the way others have described here: post house will reconform the entire sequence from the originals, grade those, finish it.

    However, on a few documentaries I did, the workflow was to convert all source files (XDCAM-HD and or DVCPRO-HD) to DNxHD185, edit, lock, do a video mixdown sans captions, send them the resulting MXF file + EDL, they would grade, send me back an Avid MXF Mediafile, I'd bring that into MC, add the captions back in, Add the sound mix in Avid, Export for broadcast.

    Wth video shows, it's often very unnecessary to reconform, and it's much faster to use the Avid as the 'online' editor (including effects). It can be a huge timesaver, and there will not be any quality difference if the route is for instance XDCAM-HD to DNxHD185 in Avid, to Scratch, back to Avid.

    The main reason for grading the source files and sending back the graded segments to MC for 'onlining' would be that you still may tweak the cut. If that's not the case, the MXF mixdown route is fast, good and valid.

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  • Thu, Mar 21 2013 2:16 PM In reply to

    Re: Preparing Sequence for Edl to Color Grading on Scratch (asimiliate)

    Pat Horridge:
    If you are using an non compatabile grading solution then you are making a lot of work.
    How is Scratch not a compatible grading solution?

    It is. It reads and writes Avid MXF mediafiles without an issue whatsoever. The suggested workflow is fast and in most cases the easiest one, and not at all inferior to roundtripping using AAF. If it's cut and locked, just grade the result, much like you would grade a master videotape in the old days (we would playout the ungraded sequence to a Digital Betacam tape, add an EDL, and there would be a tape-to-tape grading to a new graded videomaster).

    Media Composer /w Symphony option | PT-HD | Win7Pro64 HP | OSX MBP | ISIS5000 | Nitris DX | Artist Mix & Transport & Color | AJA T-Tap | Decklink... [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, Mar 21 2013 2:23 PM In reply to

    Re: Preparing Sequence for Edl to Color Grading on Scratch (asimiliate)

    Thank zou Job ter Burg.

    I will do it as you say. Videomixdown and mxf+edl.

    I have still some questions. Is it possible to you to answer concrete! thank you very much!

     

    A) How do I work with the Avid FX?

    We have 6 Videolayers with fx like:

    > motion fx

    >masks

    >3D Warp

    > transitions

    etc.

     

    The grader wants a "clean" version - without transitions. ???

    So should I take off everything?

    B) Do I have to build the EDL from the videomixdown or from the based sequence with all the edits?

    C) Do I have to put every clip on the videolayer 1?

    D) How does the EDL have to look like? Wich parameters are important!

    Thank you alot! N

  • Thu, Mar 21 2013 2:27 PM In reply to

    Re: Preparing Sequence for Edl to Color Grading on Scratch (asimiliate)

    I'm pretty sure I answered all those Q's some three posts back, including detailed settings for EDL Manager.

    Basically you can keep your seq as is, or clean it up a bit (so there are no hidden cuts underneatch overlapping footage in higher layers). The latter is a bit easier on the grader (and thereby makes you look good), the first is easier on you (and therefore saves you time and hassle).

    Media Composer /w Symphony option | PT-HD | Win7Pro64 HP | OSX MBP | ISIS5000 | Nitris DX | Artist Mix & Transport & Color | AJA T-Tap | Decklink... [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, Mar 21 2013 2:28 PM In reply to

    Re: Preparing Sequence for Edl to Color Grading on Scratch (asimiliate)

    Job ter Burg:

    Pat Horridge:
    If you are using an non compatabile grading solution then you are making a lot of work.
    How is Scratch not a compatible grading solution?

    In that unlike Symphony or even to some extent DS it won't replicate the timeline structure with all the effects.

    Therefore you need to find a solution that allows workable media and some sort of metadata to be transfered and thats not as easy as passing it to a Symphony or even a DS.

     

    ACI Moderator. I'm not employed by Avid or work for them. I just do this in my spare time. Normally using the current Media Composer version on My... [view my complete system specs]

     

    Broadcast & Post Production Consultant / Trainer  VET

     

    T 07581 201248 | E pat@vet.co.uk | W www.vet.co.uk |


    Media Composer V8.2 Review Background Render

    -

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