Latest post Thu, Jan 9 2014 4:08 PM by John Pale. 4 replies.
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  • Wed, Jan 8 2014 6:40 PM

    • sonnyfeld
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    • Joined on Wed, Jan 8 2014
    • Posts 6
    • Points 80

    Adding Audio Tracks to a Subclip

    Hello, 

    I'm an assistant editor who is on a reality project that is 3 months into dailies.  To meet the specs of our lead editor, our workflow has been to autosync video with the stereo mix of the external audio.  This way there isn't 5-9 tracks of audio on the timeline, the editor cuts with a stereo mix, and then match frames the audio if she needs isos.  This workflow was approved by the post producer on day one.

    All of our dailies have been subclipped into V1 - A1 - A2 format, it's the first thing we do when we autosync.  Yesterday, our story producers requested that we include all audio tracks in the subclips, they don't like the hasstle of matching back through groups and subclips to reach the audio isos.  Now that the show has a larger staff, the old style has been outvoted, and they have asked us to redo the dailies with all available tracks.  This is an easy adjustment moving forward, but we're talking 3 months of dailies that will need to be resynced, regrouped, markers transferred, and relabeled.  All the information to do this is in the project, but the footage is not slated, the lockit boxes are often off between 1-3 frames, and the multicams rarely share common timecode.  Our job has been devoted to getting the workflow we agreed upon right.

    Sorry for the rant.  Anyway - does anyone know a way to add audio tracks into the subclips and groups?  Is there modify command that will allow a subclip to "open up" from V1-A1-A2 and become V1-A1-A2-A3-A4-A5-A6-A7-ETC?  Then, is there a way to refresh the groups to reflect the new tracks in the subclips?  These tracks exist in the master clip, they were not included in the subclips to ease timeline clutter for the editors.

    I really hope there is a method for this.  If not we need to redo our dailies from scratch... and I don't want to come across as lazy, this is how I make my living, but I just don't think it's realistic given that we have new dailies every day, and requests from the team.

    Thanks for your help!

  • Wed, Jan 8 2014 7:13 PM In reply to

    Re: Adding Audio Tracks to a Subclip

    I don't think it can be done. Also, my vote would be for the original approach. Bloated timelines slow things down. Also depends on the quality of the 2-track mix.

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  • Wed, Jan 8 2014 7:26 PM In reply to

    • sonnyfeld
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    • Joined on Wed, Jan 8 2014
    • Posts 6
    • Points 80

    Re: Adding Audio Tracks to a Subclip

    Job ter Burg:

    I don't think it can be done. Also, my vote would be for the original approach. Bloated timelines slow things down. Also depends on the quality of the 2-track mix.

     

    Could not agree with you more.  To anybody who actually needs to use a timeline and not simply push play, the first workflow is far preferable.  The mixes occasionally have issues, so I think that is part of the reason for this shift.  

  • Thu, Jan 9 2014 6:00 AM In reply to

    Re: Adding Audio Tracks to a Subclip

    If you have a GroupClip with two or more video "banks", plus that Stereo Mix, you may be interested in trying the following rather  convoluted idea:

    Load that synced Group clip in Source monitor, with Audio follow video ON in Src and Composer monitors. Edit full Source into a new Sequence using "bank 1" video plus all its audio. Duplicate that new sequence, name it Bank 2, and press arrow once to reveal Bank 2 video.

    You now have 2 sequences one with your Group's bank 1 video on track v1, the other with the same Group's bank 2 video on V1. 

    Duplicate both Sequences protectively as what follows is Un-Undoable AFAIK.

    Highlight both duplicated sequences and press AutoSync. I believe they both will change from having a Sequence icon to a Subclip icon. Then highlight both of those new subclips and attempt to GroupClip them together.

    IF all that is successful, you can try it again, but this time attempt to create a third sequence with just your ISO audio tracks in a Sequence that you create using Match Frame from your initial GroupClip. If all your sequences for Re-Grouping have no Marks, I should think that GroupClip using Marks should keep the new "banks" in sync. Or use Timecode if possible.

    You * might * be able to get this to work - to wind up with a "Re-constituted " GroupClip, including original ISO sound tracks on tracks A3-A4....A8, etc.

     

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  • Thu, Jan 9 2014 4:08 PM In reply to

    • John Pale
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    • Joined on Thu, May 19 2011
    • NYC
    • Posts 155
    • Points 2,075

    Re: Adding Audio Tracks to a Subclip

    I know ultimately you are an assistant editor and have to do what you are told, but do you work with any producer or editor who is ummm....somewhat reasonable?  I would sit down with that person and show them step by step what doing this from scratch with a huge amount of material actually entails...then have them decide whether it's really worth it. A cost-benefit analysis.

    in my view...coming from a position of being an online editor for more than 12 years, I'd say it isn't, but this isn't my show.

    Matchframing back to the original master clip takes seconds and can be done with a keyboard shortcut. It might be slightly inconvenient for some, but it's really not a huge hassle.  And if there are audio post concerns,  The ISO audio can be tracked for audio post in software....it does not need to be included in the sequence, unless needed to deal with a problem.   Having a huge amount of audio tracks in every subclip slows down editing considerably, as it creates great complexity in patching even the simplest of edits, as well as dealing with the 24 track sequence limit and transitions.  As an editor, I don't want that, unless it's truly needed (it is in some scenarios)

    good luck.  I hope you are paid by the hour.

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