Latest post Mon, Dec 22 2014 12:17 PM by camoscato. 4 replies.
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  • Sun, Dec 21 2014 6:42 PM

    • Adrian Redmond
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Wed, May 28 2014
    • Channel 6 Television Denmark
    • Posts 176
    • Points 2,465

    Tactile control of VTR for logging/capturing

    Since May 2014 I have posted two messages about this subject and have never received a single reply - from Avid or from any other Avid users.

    My question is this - is there any Avid MC7 (Windows 7 x64) user out there who has succeeded in getting a hardware remote jog/shuttle panel - such as Avid/Euphonix Artist Transport or J L Cooper MSCS3 - to control at VTR using seriel / sony 9-pin protocol, when logging and capturing?

    For many years, working on Fast/Pinnacle (Later Avid) Liquid silver, Blue, Purple and Chrome, I tool jog shuttlecontrol of both the timeline/source viewers and a connected VTR when logging for granted. It simply worked out of the box, from 1999 until I moved to Avid this year. Logging was fast, accurate and very easy. By comparison, logging and capturing on MC7, without a hardware tactile jog/shuttle remote panel, and thus only being able to control the deck by keyboard shortcuts such as JKL or by the mouse with the MC7 logging GUI, is a slow, imprecise and very tiring process.

    I have bought and tried the Avid Artist remote panel, which is quite good for timeline/source viewer cotrol, but which doesn't work with a connected VTR. I have also tried the JL Cooper MSC3S RS422 panel, it works, but the jog/shuttle will not conmtrol reverse motion and is erratic on forward motion.

    In all other respects I find MC7 brilliant, but had I known that logging with an external controller and a VTR would be so tiresome, I would never have invested in a high-performance Avid system - VTR control, for those of us working with videotape source material or archive footage, is absolutely essential and I cannot understand why it is not possible on MC7.

    Is there any help or advice out there?

    Adrian Redmond

    teknikATchannel6DOTdk

    Avid Media Composer v. 8.5.3. with Symphony Option on HP Z820 Dual Intel E5-2640 6-core HT 2.5GHz CPU 32GB RAM NVidia Quadro K4000 Graphics on Win7x64... [view my complete system specs]

    Adrian Redmond
    Owner / Producer / Editor
    Channel 6 Television Denmark

  • Mon, Dec 22 2014 10:03 AM In reply to

    Re: Tactile control of VTR for logging/capturing

    I guess in answer fewer and fewer folks work with tape in that way any longer. Many now deal with file based ingest and of those that do deal with tape many capture in one pass and log after that.

    So the need for tactile deck control has diminished considerably.

     

    ACI Moderator. I'm not employed by Avid or work for them. I just do this in my spare time. Normally using the current Media Composer version on My... [view my complete system specs]

     

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  • Mon, Dec 22 2014 10:23 AM In reply to

    Re: Tactile control of VTR for logging/capturing

    Adrian Redmond:
    Since May 2014 I have posted two messages about this subject and have never received a single reply - from Avid or from any other Avid users.

    Hi Adrian,

    As Pat says, there's not much need for this anymore, which is probably why you're not getting a lot of response from other users.  As for Avid, if you want to hear from them you have to contact Avid support; this forum is for user to user help.

    In the future if you want to get more attention for a post, reply to it with the word "bump" which will move it back to the top of the list and let people know you still need help.  I've deleted all your other posts on this subject.

    Carl

    Media Composer 2018.12.2 w/Symphony/SS/PF options, HP Envy 17t-j100 Quad Edition laptop, Windows 10 Pro, Intel Core i7 2.4GHz, 16 GB RAM, nVidia GeForce... [view my complete system specs]

    "There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who only consider the price are this man's lawful prey."  - John Ruskin (1819-1900)

     

    Carl Amoscato | Freelance Film & Video Editor | London, UK

  • Mon, Dec 22 2014 12:00 PM In reply to

    • Adrian Redmond
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Wed, May 28 2014
    • Channel 6 Television Denmark
    • Posts 176
    • Points 2,465

    Re: Tactile control of VTR for logging/capturing

    I don't really buy that explanation! Whilst file-based work flows certainly have become more popular, there are millions of videotapes on archive wortldwide and still thousands being recorded - why else would Media Composer continue to support ingest and digital cut to a selection of over 50 professional VTR's? Whether we like it or not, videotape will be around for a long time for some users, if only because of existing archive assets. Also, there are some production environments where shooting on videotape makes sense, because the archival cost - certainly in terms of labour costs - is low, because the "transfer" of material to an arhcival medium (videotape) happens when shooting, rather than in a labour intensive process after editing where either server storage or solid-state media must be cleaned for reuse. This is certainly the case in my company, where we keep raw footage, in principle, for ever.

    I am more inclined to see the lack of tactile conmtrol as a simple programming oversight. MC7's timeline and source viewers can be controlled by external remotes and keyboard and mouse interfaces, just as VTR's can be controlled by keyboard and mouse interfaces - and some external controllers (paradoxically the JL Cooper MSC3S rather than the Avid-owned and manufactured artist series) can also control a VTR - which shows that the software capability is there in MC7, but it simply isn't implemented corretcly - or taken account of in the Artist/Eucon interface.

    There are many "legacy" features in MC7 which are still regarded as necessary for more recent production methods - composite video in and outputs, analogue audio, longitudinal timecode, and serial control of VTR's - all of which are expendable for users running on solidstate storage or firewire video deck solutions. VTR control (in my humble option) is simply another legacy feature that is still justified for thousands of users.

    Media Composer is hardly a "bare-bones" budget editing package, it is marketed, with some justification, as the most comprehensive professional editing system, and as such should continue to support those features and working methods which still figure in the professional market and which are valued by any editor who has worked with professional video for more than a few years.

    I have submitted this issue to Avid support, it's only taken since May 2014 to get the subject listed as an issue under review! Having invested over $50.000 in a HD edit suite, with over half of that sum being Avid hardware and software, I simply expect a little more in terms of service and market awareness.

    And it wouldn't hurt if Avid support contribnuted to this forum with replies more often - after all, dissatisfied customers postings here, such as mine, also reflect on Avid?

     

    Best regards / Adrian Redmond

     

     

    Avid Media Composer v. 8.5.3. with Symphony Option on HP Z820 Dual Intel E5-2640 6-core HT 2.5GHz CPU 32GB RAM NVidia Quadro K4000 Graphics on Win7x64... [view my complete system specs]

    Adrian Redmond
    Owner / Producer / Editor
    Channel 6 Television Denmark

  • Mon, Dec 22 2014 12:17 PM In reply to

    Re: Tactile control of VTR for logging/capturing

    Adrian Redmond:
    I don't really buy that explanation!

    Fair enough, but I'm not the one you need to convince.  :)

    Adrian Redmond:
    I have submitted this issue to Avid support, it's only taken since May 2014 to get the subject listed as an issue under review!

    You might also try the feature request forum:

    http://community.avid.com/forums/44.aspx

    Media Composer 2018.12.2 w/Symphony/SS/PF options, HP Envy 17t-j100 Quad Edition laptop, Windows 10 Pro, Intel Core i7 2.4GHz, 16 GB RAM, nVidia GeForce... [view my complete system specs]

    "There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who only consider the price are this man's lawful prey."  - John Ruskin (1819-1900)

     

    Carl Amoscato | Freelance Film & Video Editor | London, UK

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